John McCain biopic

[dendro]

some ideas--after the so-called fire, at the pentagon, there was little real evidence left that a plane had even crashed there. Look at the pics I linked to in my first post on this thread--immediately after the impact, precious little damage visible anywhere at the pentagon, precious few plane parts anywhere--from the crash of a loaded 767 at ground zero! Official story--the dam thing vaporised! No survivors! Neat. If you DID crash a planeload of people there, there would have been a huge mess all over the place, major damage to the building, and lots of evidence (parts, damages etc.) of what had happened to the plane. Unless you gassed everyone on board, there may have even been survivors, who could talk. Also, it was prolly easier to guide whatever fully-rigged RC Global Hawk plane was aimed at the pentagon than it would be to guide a commercial passenger 767-witness that  the second plane (not saying IT was a 767 either-in fact, the engine of a 737 crashed to the street) to crash into the WTC almost missed the building completely. Basically, it is not physically possible for the typical professional pilot, much less an untrained Arab hijacker, to maneuver a 767 in the bizarre arc of flight path supposedly taken by the alleged 767 in order to drop down and hit the pentagon. Yet the pentagon crash was precisely guided--it hit exactly in the part of the building that was vacant, minimizing loss of property etc. It made for good theater, but did little real damage. Yet we are to believe that planes that crashed into the tops of the towers quickly burned the suckers to dust.

They claim they did DNA analysis of the bodies of the victims, to verify the passenger list. But strangely, NO ARABS on board. And where are the black boxes for any of these crashes? And the local security video footage? Supposedly all confiscated by the FBI, and too classified to display. The official story doesn't work. So given that the official story is a joke, where does Occam's Razor lead next?

Slice and dice away, amigos...

[dendro]

flash animation about the pentagon strike:

http://www.pentagonstrike.co.uk/flash.htm

[dendro]

firefighters in the WTC discuss the situation, on floor 78-the crash site floor:

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/wtc2_ ... hters.html

Different article than the above link:

"Highly recognized former chief economist in Labor Department now doubts official 9/11 story, claiming suspicious facts and evidence cover-up indicate government foul play and possible criminal implications.

June 12, 2005
By Greg Szymanski

A former chief economist in the Labor Department during President Bush's first term now believes the official story about the collapse of the WTC is 'bogus,' saying it is more likely that a controlled demolition destroyed the Twin Towers and adjacent Building No. 7.

"If demolition destroyed three steel skyscrapers at the World Trade Center on 9/11, then the case for an 'inside job' and a government attack on America would be compelling," said Morgan Reynolds, Ph.D, a former member of the Bush team who also served as director of the Criminal Justice Center at the National Center for Policy Analysis headquartered in Dallas, TX.

Reynolds, now a professor emeritus at Texas A&M University, also believes it's 'next to impossible' that 19 Arab Terrorists alone outfoxed the mighty U.S. military, adding the scientific conclusions about the WTC collapse may hold the key to the entire mysterious plot behind 9/11.

"It is hard to exaggerate the importance of a scientific debate over the cause(s) of the collapse of the twin towers and building 7," said Reynolds this week from his offices at Texas A&M. "If the official wisdom on the collapses is wrong, as I believe it is, then policy based on such erroneous engineering analysis is not likely to be correct either. The government's collapse theory is highly vulnerable on its own terms. Only professional demolition appears to account for the full range of facts associated with the collapse of the three buildings.

"More importantly, momentous political and social consequences would follow if impartial observers concluded that professionals imploded the WTC. Meanwhile, the job of scientists, engineers and impartial researchers everywhere is to get the scientific and engineering analysis of 9/11 right."

However, Reynolds said "getting it right in today's security state' remains challenging because he claims explosives and structural experts have been intimidated in their analyses of the collapses of 9/11.

From the beginning, the Bush administration claimed that burning jet fuel caused the collapse of the towers. Although many independent investigators have disagreed, they have been hard pressed to disprove the government theory since most of the evidence was removed by FEMA prior to independent investigation.

Critics claim the Bush administration has tried to cover-up the evidence and the recent 9/11 Commission has failed to address the major evidence contradicting the official version of 9/11.

Some facts demonstrating the flaws in the government jet fuel theory include:

-- Photos showing people walking around in the hole in the North Tower where 10,000 gallons of jet fuel supposedly was burning..

--When the South Tower was hit, most of the North Tower's flames had already vanished, burning for only 16 minutes, making it relatively easy to contain and control without a total collapse.

--The fire did not grow over time, probably because it quickly ran out of fuel and was suffocating, indicating without added explosive devices the firs could have been easily controlled.

--FDNY fire fighters still remain under a tight government gag order to not discuss the explosions they heard, felt and saw. FAA personnel are also under a similar 9/11 gag order.

--Even the flawed 9/11 Commission Report acknowledges that "none of the [fire] chiefs present believed that a total collapse of either tower was possible."


-- Fire had never before caused steel-frame buildings to collapse except for the three buildings on 9/11, nor has fire collapsed any steel high rise since 9/11.

-- The fires, especially in the South Tower and WTC-7, were relatively small.

-- WTC-7 was unharmed by an airplane and had only minor fires on the seventh and twelfth floors of this 47-story steel building yet it collapsed in less than 10 seconds.

-- WTC-5 and WTC-6 had raging fires but did not collapse despite much thinner steel beams.

-- In a PBS documentary, Larry Silverstein, the WTC leaseholder, told the fire department commander on 9/11 about WTC-7 that. "may be the smartest thing to do is pull it," slang for demolish it.

-- It's difficult if not impossible for hydrocarbon fires like those fed by jet fuel (kerosene) to raise the temperature of steel close to melting.

Despite the numerous holes in the government story, the Bush administration has brushed aside or basically ignored any and all critics. Mainstream experts, speaking for the administration, offer a theory essentially arguing that an airplane impact weakened each structure and an intense fire thermally weakened structural components, causing buckling failures while allowing the upper floors to pancake onto the floors below.

One who supports the official account is Thomas Eager, professor of materials engineering and engineering systems at MIT. He argues that the collapse occurred by the extreme heat from the fires, causing the loss of loading-bearing capacity on the structural frame.

Eagar points out the steel in the towers could have collapsed only if heated to the point where it "lost 80 percent of its strength," or around 1,300 degrees Fahrenheit. Critics claim his theory is flawed since the fires did not appear to be intense and widespread enough to reach such high temperatures.

Other experts supporting the official story claim the impact of the airplanes, not the heat, weakened the entire structural system of the towers, but critics contend the beams on floors 94-98 did not appear severely weakened, much less the entire structural system.

Further complicating the matter, hard evidence to fully substantiate either theory since evidence is lacking due to FEMA's quick removal of the structural steel before it could be analyzed. Even though the criminal code requires that crime scene evidence be kept for forensic analysis, FEMA had it destroyed or shipped overseas before a serious investigation could take place.

And even more doubt is cast over why FEMA acted so swiftly since coincidentally officials had arrived the day before the 9/11 attacks at New York's Pier 29 to conduct a war game exercise, named "Tripod II."

Besides FEMA's quick removal of the debris, authorities considered the steel quite valuable as New York City officials had every debris truck tracked on GPS and even fired one truck driver who took an unauthorized lunch break.

In a detailed analysis just released supporting the controlled demolition theory, Reynolds presents a compelling case.


"First, no steel-framed skyscraper, even engulfed in flames hour after hour, had ever collapsed before. Suddenly, three stunning collapses occur within a few city blocks on the same day, two allegedly hit by aircraft, the third not," said Reynolds. "These extraordinary collapses after short-duration minor fires made it all the more important to preserve the evidence, mostly steel girders, to study what had happened.

"On fire intensity, consider this benchmark: A 1991 FEMA report on Philadelphia's Meridian Plaza fire said that the fire was so energetic that 'beams and girders sagged and twisted, but despite this extraordinary exposure, the columns continued to support their loads without obvious damage.' Such an intense fire with consequent sagging and twisting steel beams bears no resemblance to what we observed at the WTC."


After considering both sides of the 9/11 debate and after thoroughly sifting through all the available material, Reynolds concludes the government story regarding all four plane crashes on 9/11 remains highly suspect.

"In fact, the government has failed to produce significant wreckage from any of the four alleged airliners that fateful day. The familiar photo of the Flight 93 crash site in Pennsylvania shows no fuselage, engine or anything recognizable as a plane, just a smoking hole in the ground," said Reynolds. "Photographers reportedly were not allowed near the hole. Neither the FBI nor the National Transportation Safety Board have investigated or produced any report on the alleged airliner crashes."

[dendro]

I see this topic is a nonstarter. I triple triple suckanipple promise not to go there again.  

[laughingwillow]

What topic? John McCain? heeh

lw

[dendro]

hey, I WAS on topic--for a while  :wink:

[laughingwillow]

SO, back off topic....

I read some info at one of the last links provided earlier today concerning the isreali/wtc connection.......

It would seem to me to be only natural for members of moussad to be cheering on what happened on 9/11 for the simple hope that the act would solidfy the bond between the U$ and Isreal. I'm willing to bet there were high level talks in the isreali gubmint concerning cncerning just this scenario way before it happened.

I can't figure out any connection of the isreali spy masters ot the events in nyc duriing 9/11 with the exception of dogs sniffing traces of explosives when nothing specific was found in their vans.

Why go to all the trouble and potential danger in rigging an attack to APPEAR masterminded by islamic extremists when there are factions lining up for the honor of doing the job.

And also, it would appear natural for the isreali agents to HOPE to pin the attacks on palestinian factions in an effort to further their national cause  wit hthe U$ as well.

But then one question still remains.... wtf are isreali massoud agents doing sniffing around our back yards?  

lw

[dendro]

yeah, a lot of Israeli "art students" and "movers" left the US right after 9/11. DC is an Israeli capital now.

Lewin, a MOussaoud hijack expert, was seated in the center of the group of so-called "Arab hijackers" on one of the NY planes. Initial reports from the plane during the hijack, given by the stews, said that the passenger in seat 6, Lewin, was shooting the pilots.

The extremists may have been lining up (where's THAT queue?), but that doesn't prevent them from being led by "agents of a foreign power". Some so-called Al Qaeda have turned out to be Israelis or their surrogates. There are Israelis in Iraq now, and they are able to do much espionage.

Anyhoo, I like to ask, "Who benefits?" Iraqis? Iranians? Afghanis? Pakistanis? Israelis? The Israelis wanted much more than just more support in their Palestinian struggle. They wanted to take the ME. They are now well on their way. What's next? They now push for Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon.

I'm watching The Grateful Dead Movie, and thinking about the Book of Laughingwillow, what a trip. The movie shows the highlights, everything a stone groove. But the Book of LW shows the occult side of the trip too. You went thru way more than it would take to put me in a rubber room, brah. And you're still truckin,  

[laughingwillow]

Thanks for the kind words, den.

Now, I know this may look like I'm sucking up to you for spreading on the flattery above, but I can assure you thats no the case. The isreali's pulling this off makes more sense to me than our admin. (unless you think they were in cahoots.)

Isreal is in a tenous position. They prolly feel their very survival is on the line. Depserate folks do desperate things. I can at least conceive of this as a possibility.

Add that to the fact that the U$ relationship with isreal has historically ran hot or cold, I can see how they would feel the need to attempt to influence the directions of world events and maybe our loyalty to their cause.  

lw

[dendro]

LW:

"The isreali's pulling this off makes more sense to me than our admin. (unless you think they were in cahoots.) "

cahoots, yeah. Neocons in the Pentagon, DOD, White House, State, etc. etc. Dov Zakheim, dual citizen, ran the pentagon for many years. He also was involved in a remote control aircraft corp. Read Operation Northwoods for a blueprint of 9/11 written in the sixties. The war industry needs war to profit. Israel is a natural partner in US war industry. AIPAC fed Franklin (DOD office of special plans) the fake Iraq intel needed to sway congress, with Cheney's blessing.

"Add that to the fact that the U$ relationship with isreal has historically ran hot or cold, I can see how they would feel the need to attempt to influence the directions of world events and maybe our loyalty to their cause."

yes. with great success, at present.

Is the Book of Laughingwillow lost from the web, with the demise of SPF? I think I may have missed some early chapters.

[laughingwillow]

Hey, den.

I'm guessing the book of laughingwillow is partially gone now that spf went down. I'm pretty sure i have a copy of most of the chapters on my computer somewhere. I'll snoop around a little and post if found.

Thanks for the encouragement, btw.

lw

[dendro]

O yeah brah, an important work of social history, insight into a special scene, and psychedelic spirituality, should be widely read imo.