Peyote substitute Oncinum Ceboletta

[Amomynous]

I always thought the Plants of the Gods was ghost written, it didn't seem to be worhty of the two giants Hoffman and Shultes. What say you Boomer? It does have a lot of nice pictures.

Well, that is what grad students are for...

(... unfortunately, Shultes' grad students -- Plowman, Davis -- were almost as extraordinary as the teacher.)

[Amomynous]

PLEASE HELP US OBTAIN THIS BOTANICALS!

OFFER IT ON THE TRADE BOARDS!

MAIL IT TO MEMBERS!

PROPAGATE! PROPAGATE! PROPAGATE! PROPAGATE! PROPAGATE! PROPAGATE! PROPAGATE! PROPAGATE!

Careful there boy, once you get the bill for the exclamation mark tax (not to mention the all-caps surcharge) you're going to be hurtin'

Edit: And I would like to say that while research is good (after all, it is our cultural heritage), it shouldn't be indiscriminant.  Discernment is good so that one can focus and actually accomplish something. If you actually had every "rare, unknown plant" that you've screamed for, you would have neither the space to grow them nor the time to investigate them.

Second Edit: And if you're really interested, you should be forwarded that orchids are very challenging plants to grow. If you're serious (which I doubt, but I try to give people the benefit of the doubt) you should probably start with the bromeliads. After honing your technique for a year or two (and then perhaps constructing a green-house), maybe then it would be good to move on to orchids.  

Are you serious? Do you have the attention span to spend a few years on a plant?

[Anonymous]

Wicked cool!

[Amomynous]

Are you talking to me?

I thought I was, but I'm starting to wonder.

[Zaka]

Irie Stoney,
I have so many orchids and can identify all.......some time at running or driving pace I can find them....
It's so easy here, just sling'em in a tree and they go nuts......
Ceboletta have such distinctive leaves you really don't need to see it in flower........The only orchid that could be mistaken for it is B.Cugullata, not in flower, and I've been searching here for years with out finding it.
I'll not going crazy getting all scientific about it, weighing and measuring stuff. WIGIT that's my moto....Let the spirit guide.
I'll try to take some photo's...
Nice Cactus's Theo.........Gotta get round to putting a cactus garden together.........soon
Respect
Z

[Stonehenge]

Z, that's very interesting. I ask again, are the locals using it for recreational purposes and have you tried it since you are so familiar with it?

[Zaka]

Irie Stoney,
No mate no one here knows of it....
Not traditionally used....
But the people here are mostly ignorant about their heritage, much of it has been lost.
Mostly budheads here.........most don't even know or use shooms.....Respect
Z

[Bushpig]

We should not shoot down Teo's enthusiasm, but maybe help direct him to be be successful in his research ?

My advice Teo is to get a specimen if you can, be very careful about consumption, as there may be dangers of toxicity.  

And hold back on the rants for everyone to propogate it, as at present nobody knows of its virtues or lack of.  Let us know how you get on Teo

Boooshpig

[Anonymous]

Let us know how it goes!

AND SEND US SOME PLANTS/SEEDS!!!

[M S Smith]

Seeing that Christian Ratsch is a co-author of the revised and expanded Plants of the Gods (http://www.amazon.com/Plants-Gods-Sacre ... 0892819790) I have always suspected he was the "ghost author" of the original, as clearly the original wasn't to the standards of publications by either Schultes or Hofmann.  For some reason I don't have Ratsches encylopedia book, but I wonder if it mentions anythink else about O. ceboletta.  The original reference comes from one of Schultes' Harvard Botanical Letters.

O. ceboletta my be considered a replacement for the "true hikuri," but that doesn't indicate what use of the original it is replacing.  Seeing that hikuri has a multitude of uses it may be purely medicinal and as a salve for all we know.  Any comments in the literature about the plant being a hikuri fail to say anything about its use, much less its use specifically as an entheogen to alter consciousness.  I'd be very cautious about the use of the plant being there is a good work-up on its full range of constituents.

As for growing it, by all means, but I do believe it is commonly used as a hybrid parent, and if that is the case then you may not be getting the same genetics as the one in the territory of the Tarahumara, in fact, this is such a widespread plant throughout the Americas you really should try to find imports from southwwestern Chihuahua, Mexico.

Good luck,

~Michael~

[meme]

I would taste the plant, the flowers, the seeds, the pods, the roots, the stems, the leaves, etc.  Are any of the bitter?   What other tastes, if they are bitter, is there?

Then, I would use testing kits to see if there was any interesting reactions.  A Marquis testing kit evaluation, for example, would be interesting to see on any part of the plant that was bitter.

However, I cannot say that this is alone to know if the plant is safe to consume.  Look at sun-opener, with its high oxalic acid content before it is fermented in the sun.  However, I think that a bitter taste and reactions like indones or phenethylamines could be enough to get some cultivation by members, and possibly some attention by some real scientists with labs.  

Still, just a LITTLE info about preparation could make it safer to try . . .

BTW, I could prolly send you a testing kit  :cool3

[Zaka]

Irie Folk's,
Well did some tea with a bunch(ten'ish) of the leaves & Pseudobulb (figure this is where the active ingredient is), boiled it up, reduced it down, added more water and a white sage tea bag, for flavor.......tasted alright.....
As for effect.....I'm afraid that it was inconclusive.......Due to a Near Death Experience;
The previous days antics...Winter Solstice...
Well My brother was down for the Xmas and happen to bring along 3g of some sort of Mexican mushrooms. So we embarked The Solstice Sacred Mountain Mission.......the days aim, to plant Anadenanthera Colubrina on top.
Well, we downed the shroom tea, then a shot of my special mushroom Mescal Tequila  :shock:  and set off for the mountain.......side mission MJ clone at base plot....which took ten minutes.....
A beautiful day, dry, clear skies......start to feel the shooms kicking in.....Off on the assent.
So we are wandering along checking out some local plants on the way.......looking for Tabernaemontana Citrifolia specimen for my garden...
When all of a sudden...*Crack* rocks start to roll, trees are being broken in half as a hail of rock rain down on us. I look back to see a very large boulder passing my bro...everything goes slow motion...........we duck for cover as the rock continue to fall from 1,800ft above.....taking cover wasn't easy and I was wishing I had packed my rock climbing helmet....damn too late now!
I manage to get down behind a tree as my bro reaches my side, then **pow** a rock bounces off my head, :e_surprised:  landing in the crook of a tree, a next one hits my leg, resulting in a good cut, and a next rock hits my back....
After about 4 minutes all is quiet......we start to get our shit together......Enuff to say that this really messed up the shooms as we had to get real, real fast.....I start wondering if the Gods were trying to kill us or teach us some friggin' respect.....Tie my leg and back to the assent.....
Now the knock on the head didn't put me out but left me with slight concussion.....hard to tell with the shooms...
As we continue I notice that I'm get dizzy off balance feeling when I look upwards. So don't look up!
We reach the summit and set about trying some smoking blend......nuff to say we smoke mj all day!
First up...my first hit of Salvia.....scored a vile of 5x in UK earlier in the year......popped it in the pipe with a local tobacco base..drew hard and held it.....Nothing...not a bloody thing! Bro tries it nope.....this shit must be dud. Still had a 10x that I left at home 2,500ft down.........
Next mix.....Justicia leaf, Ambrosia hisida leaf and  what turned out to be the nicest smoke Mucuna pruriens flowers....This actually gave us a buzz......Well my head was spinning...... :smoke2:
We complete mission Cohoba planting 20 seed that I had soak for an hour...........there is Justicia at the base, sun bleach snail shells scattering on the path on the way up.....everything needed!!?.... :smoke:3
Well we make it back down without further incident....but my head is still pounding....drive home OK....seem to be functioning.....
Although I don't usually use any pharms....thought I better down a couple of soluble aspirin to quickly thin out my blood and prevent any aneurysms.....
Well after ten days and plenty of turmeric tea, the spinning has stopped.
We did the orchid tea the next day.....I'm sure I was buzzing on it but my bro said it didn't do shit.....
Suffice to say it didn't kill us.....and it does in my opinion warrants further investigation..
I'll do a take two after I've completed an aloe purge/ detox.....and get my head right! :tea:  
Respect
Z

[Anonymous]

Thank you for doing this work.

I cannot tell you how much it is apperciated.

[Zaka]

Irie,
The ceboletta has just flowered but I then noticed a bitch of a case of scale......trying to get a handle on the out break which is also affecting some of the other orchids. used a weak solution with teatree oil so far....
Respect
Z

[Zaka]

Here's the brew...[attachment=1:2tt14irh]100_1719a.JPG[/attachment:2tt14irh]
Mucuna pruriens flowers[attachment=0:2tt14irh]100_1413a.JPG[/attachment:2tt14irh]