Irie,
I'm not sure if you guys are still awake, but the totalitarian tip-toe is now turning into a boot stomping on your toes!
Are you going to wait till they kick you in the nuts?
Obama Poised to Cede US Sovereignty; //http://blacklistednews.com/news-5961-0-9-9--.html
[youtube:37l3myly]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlTagSZPm7o&feature=related[/youtube:37l3myly]
Good luck with the denial!
Respect
Z
I really feel sorry for you, man.
lw
Quote from: "laughingwillow"I really feel sorry for you, man.
lw
Irie LW,
Good luck with the denial!
Respect
Z
Don't take this the wrong way Zaka, but you really are the most close-minded person on the board.
Think about that.
I think I just threw up in my mouth. Coincidence?.......... or deadly plot set to dazzle, beguile and lull....
One world government yall! That meens less humans right?
zaka: The only thing I deny is having all of the answers.
anj: As I understand it, a one-world gubmit would entail roughly the same number of peoples while the number of cheese burgers would be expected to increase exponentially.
lw
Quote from: "laughingwillow"zaka: The only thing I deny is having all of the answers.
anj: As I understand it, a one-world gubmit would entail roughly the same number of peoples while the number of cheese burgers would be expected to increase exponentially.
lw
Irie LW,
Keep eating the burgers! :lol:
//http://www.5min.com/Video/The-4-Year-Old-McDonalds-Cheeseburger-Part-1-37002713
Yumm!
Respect
Z
LOL We found one of those fries in da wife's car once many years ago. I smelled it every time I got into her car for prolly over a year before she finally found it one day while cleaning the interior.
lw
Quote from: "laughingwillow"cheese burgers
omnomnom
Quote from: "Syd"Quote from: "laughingwillow"cheese burgers
omnomnom
Irie Syd,
Did you mean "Ohnomon"!
Respect,
Z
No (//http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=omnomnom).
Quote from: "Syd"No (//http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=omnomnom).
Irie Syd,
Shite you learn something new every day Eh!
Just don't see anything tasty about 4 year old McD's. Or for that matter even when they are fresh[er].
I personally can't eat plastic food.
Ohnomon! Stick that in your Urban dictionary!
Respect
Z
omnomnom.... This appears to be a conundrum of Homeric proportion. :ugeek:
lw
You say "one world government" like it's a bad thing. What did John Lennon say:
Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion
too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace...
Quote from: "JRL"You say "one world government" like it's a bad thing.
I've thought a bit about this, and my thinking has changed over time.
Nationalism and the like aren't good things, so I used to think that a push towards globalization and expansiveness was good. And one one level it
could be considered a good thing, if it were to decrease the sense of separation felt between people.
But the more deeply I looked into the issue (and entheogens help with this kind of exploration, btw :) ), the more I saw it as a problem of structure and teleology, not of politics or psychology. In short, mankind's social structures have reached (and actually exceeded) the limits that top-down teleologies can produce.
If one takes one's cue from nature, human society is the only thing that is structured that way. Sometimes one will have top-down in small, local areas (like in a wolf pack), but the overall organizational structure of, well, everything--from ecologies to physical systems--it's bottoms-up and emergent. No centralization exists in the world, apart from man and his desires.
The top-down approach of centralization is structurally broken when applied to large, complex systems; I don't think we can find a single counter-example in the visible universe. And until we can get beyond that mindset there is no hope for mankind.
amom: I like the direction you have steered this conversation.
There are quite a few examples of local top-down hierarchies in nature. Bees, cats, some primates and wolves being a few. Also, the breeding of many species is controlled by dominant herd members.
And as humans are part of nature, I dare say our social systems are just as organic. However, there does appear to be a point at which a centralized decision making process is too large and cumbersome to efficiently and effectively meet local needs.
Its mind blowing to think how far technology has progressed since our country was founded. And yet, we continue to conduct our collective affairs much as we did over 200 years ago...
lw
Quote from: "JRL"You say "one world government" like it's a bad thing. What did John Lennon say:
Imagine there's no countries
Irie,
I don't think Lennon meant "one world government" by saying no countries.
Might have made an interesting line though.
Imagine a one world government,
Run by a new world order,
Living in tyranny, oh ho,
No need for elections,
Everyone with lovely tracking chips,
Controlled by gestapo,
(Everyone sing)
Living in tyranny....Oh ho :lol:
Respect
Z
Quote from: "JRL"What did John Lennon say...Living life in peace...
APC did a sick ass cover of Imagine, kinda makes my ears tingle!
its a great song, my band the Jokers does it too.
Quote from: "JRL"its a great song, my band the Jokers does it too.
Does it happen to be on youtube or anywhere else? I'd like to listen to it.
Quote from: "Syd"Quote from: "JRL"What did John Lennon say...Living life in peace...
APC did a sick ass cover of Imagine, kinda makes my ears tingle!
Irie,
Sorry who the fuck is APC?
Probably some crappy MTV bullshit band?
I don't know? Still keeping away for poisonous TV!
Respect
Z
Quote from: "laughingwillow"There are quite a few examples of local top-down hierarchies in nature. Bees, cats, some primates and wolves being a few. Also, the breeding of many species is controlled by dominant herd members.
Yes, there are some top-down structures, but they tend to act locally, or at an individual level.
Even given that, it seems like the more we learn, the less hierarchical some of these structures are. A perfect example is in the individual. The brain has long been considered the "central controller" of the body, but as we learn more about human and animal physiology the more broadly we have to define "brain."
Thinking isn't limited to the cranium: the entire nervous system, the heart, the stomach--these all play some role is what we consider cognition. Throw in the endocrine system, and one quickly sees that our mental states are a whole-body phenomena.
DNA is another example. When DNA was discovered it was thought of as the controlling code that determined the ontogeny of the individual, but many of the brightest biologists are starting not to see it that way. The development of the individual arises from the interface and interaction between the genetics and he environment (that's why, for example, cells move from identical copies near conception to fully differentiated types at birth). Since people like predictions, here's one: in 20 years time scientists won't even be studying genes as things in themselves as they are now; all research will be conducted placing strong emphasis on gene expression, giving environment equal emphasis to genetics.
QuoteAnd as humans are part of nature, I dare say our social systems are just as organic. However, there does appear to be a point at which a centralized decision making process is too large and cumbersome to efficiently and effectively meet local needs.
They (we) are organic and natural, and I would have to say that we've already reached a level where they are maladaptive and inefficient.
Efficiency is an interesting idea, in part because it is often confused with optimization (I wrote about that sometime recently; hopefully it wasn't here). Efficiency is good--biospheres, individuals, and ecologies are all highly efficient--but it is possible to over-optimize things. Over-optimization leads to fragility and
inefficiency (in the long run), and I would posit that we've also hit that point in human society. The current "financial crisis," for example, doesn't come from the fact that our markets are efficient. It comes from them being over-optimized, and thus very sensitive to perturbations.
Further complicating things is the fact that sometimes optimization and efficiency are correlated, so trades need to be made between efficiency and sensitivity to external conditions (think of a manufacturing plant that uses a just-in-time supply chain; it is very efficient, but if there is a perturbation with one of the suppliers the whole thing comes screeching to a halt). Unfortunately, as a whole we almost always over-optimize by choosing efficiency over stability and robustness, and so we have some very fragile systems out there!
One-world government is an example of an optimized, efficient system that is so over-extended in terms of scale that I can't imagine how it wouldn't end in disaster. At our core, we humans have a real fetish for control, and establishing such a government would allow us to self-actualize in a very bad way!
QuoteIts mind blowing to think how far technology has progressed since our country was founded. And yet, we continue to conduct our collective affairs much as we did over 200 years ago...
Hmm. I'll have to think about this. At first blush it seems to be that we conduct our affairs in a very different way. Can you clarify?
Irie Amomynous,
Excellent post :bravo
Loads of good stuff to chew on!
Respect
Z
Clarification: Our form of State/Federal Gubmit as well as election procedures have remained fairly constant over the past two centuries even though technology has changed the way we do bidness.
lw
quote zaka: Sorry who the fuck is APC?
Probably some crappy MTV bullshit band?
I don't know?
I find the above statements to be quite interesting. Especially in light of the fact that I also didn't know the band to which Sid referred. The difference being that I didn't automatically jump to the conclusion that Syd was recommending "a crappy MTV bullshit band."
I guess I feel a little sorry for any fellow who claims to shun pop culture but still feels a need to bring up McDonalds and MTV in the same thread due to the mention of a band called APC and cheese burgers......... I don't know?
Quote from: "Zaka"Sorry who the fuck is APC?
Probably some crappy MTV bullshit band?
I don't know?
Ever heard of Google? APC is A Perfect Circle, a Maynard James Keenan side project, the lead singer of Tool. Maynard is a god among men.
Kids these days.
Quote from: "Syd"Quote from: "JRL"its a great song, my band the Jokers does it too.
Does it happen to be on youtube or anywhere else? I'd like to listen to it.
Not yet.
Quote from: "laughingwillow"Clarification: Our form of State/Federal Gubmit as well as election procedures have remained fairly constant over the past two centuries even though technology has changed the way we do bidness.
That's a good example.
I guess it's a testament to the Founding Fathers that they were able to create something that has continued to "kind of work" for so long!
Quote from: "Zaka"Still keeping away for poisonous TV!
I don't even own a TV.
Quote from: "Zaka"Probably some crappy MTV bullshit band?
I don't know? Still keeping away for poisonous TV!
Respect
With regards to poisonous TV: Prisonplanet is all bunnies and daisies? You can claim that it's "all true," but that still doesn't mean that it doesn't poison your mind.
The medium is the message.
Like Syd, I stay away from all TV, and have for about a decade. I can't see a reason for it.
I still watch a little tv, but hardly ever turn it on. The wife usually turns it on at some point in the evening and we watch (look for ) a movie or something. On the other hand, I DO watch an occasional college wrestling match or football game on the tube. Luckily many away Hawk wrestling matches are streamed on da net, so between those on the tube and net and those we catch live, I don't miss many iowa wrestling matches.
Of course, we get all of our news from comedy central. Particularly, the Daily and Corbert shows.
lw
Quote from: "Syd"Quote from: "Zaka"Sorry who the fuck is APC?
Probably some crappy MTV bullshit band?
I don't know?
Ever heard of Google? APC is A Perfect Circle, a Maynard James Keenan side project, the lead singer of Tool. Maynard is a god among men.
Kids these days.
Irie,
Sorry haven't had a chance to shout ya back....been crazy busy at work.
I'll get back to ya soon, in the mean time this should have you all laughing till I get back!
Where I live is a cultural musical dessert.
We have mind numbing repetitive Soca, which just pisses me off cos it's so brainless....
Then we've got friggin Counrty & Western, which also grates me!!!
But it's huge here, one village I lived in every Sunday morning at 7am they crank up the set. But not in just one location, No! 3-4 different sets blasting out the oldest C&W tunes....Often they have the same CD but play it at different times so you hear the same tune from 4 different location, repetitively throughout the day....
Respect
Z
Dude you say "friggin country and western" like its a bad thing.
You ever listen to Merle Haggard, Lefty Frizell, George Jones, Hank Williams, or Willie Nelson??
Everyone of those men is a friggin genius poet and singer.
Quote from: "JRL"Dude you say "friggin country and western" like its a bad thing.
You ever listen to Merle Haggard, Lefty Frizell, George Jones, Hank Williams, or Willie Nelson??
Everyone of those men is a friggin genius poet and singer.
Irie,
Yep! All of them, very loud, every Sunday for a year straight.
Probably hear them, Merle Haggard, Lefty Frizell, George Jones, Hank Williams, & Willie Nelson simultaneously !!
Just not my cuppa tea!
Respect
Z
Irie,
Wake Up Call;//http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3543161691381895251#
Respect
Z
I've always figured that if there was a one world government, and one happened to dislike the current regime, there is no where to go, no where to move to change the scenery. If said government became corrupt or fascist or whatnot, there would be no alternatives.
What exactly is so wrong with sovereignty? Each country should be proud to stand up and 'be itself'. Whole cultures could be lost, and all individuality squelched if everyone conformed to the 'diversity stew'.