Am having trouble finding info on how to do this. Yah suppose a simple Acid/Base extraction would work?
yes. harmine and related alkaloids should behave in a manner that allows isolation by acid/base type extractions.
Wouldn't it be easier to use a Manske extraction and then convert to base with something like ammonia once the alkaloids were extracted? Or does this only work with P. harmala (having a higher alkaloidal concentration)?
Yeah I read something about this manske/hassenblumerfultinhofferer(sp?) technique using vinegar and such over at the aya forum, but the information on how to do it wasn't very detailed and I couldn't get anybody to elaborate on it....... sounded pretty simple though.
never did it but one of my friends did, from peganum. it works.
I was skeptical of the vinegar/salt method and had a discussion about it elsewhere. My skepticism was based on my initial thinking that someone had come up with a mistaken means of creating hydrochloric acid. The explanation that was given was that the addition of table salt changes the solvency power of the vinegar solution.
Ope! I found it. Was just looking in the wrong places. Erowid has info on the manske tek in the Rue vault.
yeh I tried this, and maybe I did it wrong but I doubt it, but all I got was a suspension of caapi particles in solution, with a thin layer of gunk on the bottom of the vessel like you would get from anything left in the fridge for days. I am told that the harmalas were in the bottom layer, but it was not a clean layer, and I never tried it out-disappointing. No crystals for me-I guess you can get a crude and dirty extract, prolly works, but I think much will be left in suspension. Might as well drink it... 8)
I should try this with caapi LEAF tea, might be cleaner?
Tried the Manske method on caapi a couple times without luck, though it does seem to work well with P. harmala seed. Also tried an A/B with what came out of the Manske attempt and ended up with the most god awful emulsion I've ever seen or heard of, it didn't settle out with mixing, with heat, or even several months worth of time just sitting there.
Would the method for obtaining iboga alkaloid residues work for caapi alkaloids?
They use some sort of acidic solution made with the roots and after filtration ammonia is used to raise the pH which causes the alkaloids to crash and settle.
I've seen caapi tea have a lot of sediment settle out over the course of a month in the fridge, I've wondered if the cold was causing some of the alkaloid to crash out in the concentrated solution, the acid used was food grade citric.
Bit of an old thread -- sorry to dig up the dead, but I haven't been at the site for a month or two.
Concerning the freebasing of beta-carbolines: If one were to smoke beta-carbolines, say, after depositing on a smoking matrix, would one want to convert to freebase, or are the HCl salts (the product of the Manske extraction) suitable?
Enquiring minds want to know!
The freebase works way better.
Thanks JRL!